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Post by chandlerklebs on Nov 28, 2015 21:47:43 GMT -5
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Post by davidjoseph on Nov 30, 2015 8:09:30 GMT -5
I notice people are answering with causal factors without addressing the idea of those causal factors being beyond someones control. Metabolism seems to be a popular answer but then surely the question would become "Why do some people with a slow metabolism lose weight while others can't?". I was listening to QI last night and they were talking about will power. Someone mentioned that it's incredibly easy to resist eating a cake or a pizza right after you've just eaten a cake or a pizza. Perhaps that might not apply to prader willi syndrome but I'm reasonably sure it applies to everyone else. I think it'd be a great idea to check out the comments on this story : www.msn.com/en-gb/health/fitness/sugar-tax-is-it-enough-to-solve-the-obesity-crisis/ar-AAfOtD2?li=AAaeUIW&ocid=mailsignoutmdThese are the people who make the most noise and reject what we say. I'm not sure if logic or reason can turn people who think the way these people do. |
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Post by chandlerklebs on Nov 30, 2015 8:56:24 GMT -5
Thanks for the reply David. I noticed this paragraph in the link you gave.
"Of course as individuals we should all take personal responsibility for our own health, and many people are working hard to improve their health. But we live in an environment that doesn’t always lend itself to making healthy choices, that’s why we want to reset the defaults so that eating well isn’t always hard to do."
It's like "Of course personal responsibility!". It's one of the unquestioned ideas that people need to start thinking about rather than just assuming it's true.
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Post by davidjoseph on Nov 30, 2015 9:28:13 GMT -5
Exactly. The comments on that story seem pretty even right now. Some people defending peoples "lack of choice" so to speak through environmental conditions and what not without referencing the problem of free will. But I predict over the next few hours/days it will be overloaded with people saying how easy it is for them to eat healthy and exercise so why can't everyone.
I'm hoping it'll give us something to think about for future responses for when we try to create an app.
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Post by Mitch_J on Nov 30, 2015 17:47:19 GMT -5
If you want to do something more than anything else,
and you have the ability to do that thing with ease,
and it is the appropriate time and place to do that thing,
and both you and everyone else you are concerned with will react positively to you doing that thing,
then why wouldn't you do it?
Why would you ever do that which you do not want to do, unless something is preventing you from doing that thing?
Of course, if something is preventing you from doing that thing, then , clearly, you are not "free" to do that which you truly want to do. If you could overcome the barrier, why wouldn't you? Well, the only logical reason would be that another barrier prevents you from overcoming it. If not, you would overcome it.
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Post by chandlerklebs on Nov 30, 2015 18:48:44 GMT -5
If you want to do something more than anything else, and you have the ability to do that thing with ease, and it is the appropriate time and place to do that thing, and both you and everyone else you are concerned with will react positively to you doing that thing, then why wouldn't you do it? Why would you ever do that which you do not want to do, unless something is preventing you from doing that thing? Of course, if something is preventing you from doing that thing, then , clearly, you are not "free" to do that which you truly want to do. If you could overcome the barrier, why wouldn't you? Well, the only logical reason would be that another barrier prevents you from overcoming it. If not, you would overcome it. Mitch, I love how you explained it. This shows why we don't even have a compatibilist type of free will. If free will doesn't let us do what we want, then what exactly is it supposed to be used for? This is extremely relevant to people wanting to lose weight but who are not able to. |
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Post by davidjoseph on Dec 1, 2015 11:25:49 GMT -5
Great reply as an example of what I think we should expect. I know it's not our job to make everyone on the planet see sense but these people will be loud and incredibly unwilling to accept the kind of things we'll be saying.
"53 and well within my ideal bmi as I don't over indulge in junk food and high sugar drinks. There's no excuse for obesity in kids its bad parenting and as for adults being obese, I'll say it again GREED. I know all I need to know about human nature, its so easy to shift the blame onto anybody and everybody for their lack of self disipline. Yes I am intolerant of obese people as they are a strain on the already over stretched NHS." - 53 Year Old Free Will Believer
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